Burn Out with Julie Turney

Blog / Burn Out with Julie Turney

by | Aug 17, 2022 | The Human Factor

Hello again, from the human factor. I am very excited to get into today’s conversation. I have with me TEDx speaker podcast host. Author. I always love saying author, right? We all know the work that goes into writing a book, an advocate to all HR professionals, Julie Turner Julie’s firm works with HR professionals that are feeling burned out.

Julie, how are you doing today? Hi. Cool. I’m doing really well today. How about you? I’m doing really well. You are comfortably located in St. Thomas Barbados, correct? Yes, I am. Okay, so just go ahead, and tell our audience right now.

Just look outside the window and just share with us the weather. It’s absolutely overcast okay. Okay. I will take your overcast today. I’m right outside of Nashville in Brentwood, Tennessee. I’m looking outside. It’s very overcast it today. We had a little bit of rain yesterday, which we needed, but anytime you have one of those wonderful cities, if, if, if we say Nashville, people immediately think country music, right?

If we say Barbados, people immediately think of the most beautiful weather in the world. They first say now Rihanna, Rihanna. That’s exactly right. That’s exactly right. So our team connected with you on Instagram, and you know, Julie, you get it, you get the channel, you get the message, the consistency, as I like to say, the authenticity, , of your message.

if you’re not honestly pauses this episode right now, and jump over to LinkedIn and Instagram and follow Julie Turney, , if. Listening right now, look into, , our show notes and we have all the links on how you can connect, , with Julie below. , Julie, I want to dive right into the conversation. You have been working with HR professionals for some time now, and, , really excited to get into talking about your book.

I see that you launched that book June of 2021, a very interesting time, uh, in our world, uh, right. To, launch a book, but I’m gonna dive right into our first question here. Okay. So. Let’s talk about post-pandemic, uh, hybrid model, remote work, all the things that come around post-pandemic. What are some of your clients saying to you today?

Oh, so many things. Where do I begin? Okay. First and foremost, a lot of my clients, because I work specifically with HR professionals, are actually struggling with leaders who are now going back are trying to Rene on the hybrid models. So. Now they want people in the office and, and that’s a huge issue for a lot of people.

It’s almost like, did you really get the message of what the pandemic was trying to say to us exactly about how people struggling with their mental health or, you know, that the way people live their lives is completely different now. And giving people the option to be able to work from home or work from the office is important.

Are you not seeing the data you. And how the other thing too is how do we make the hybrid model work for us? Because every organization is not the same. And so hybrid, can’t be a one size fits all. Like we can’t put hybrid models in for, um, you know, people need to be there to serve. So, how do you create a model where people don’t feel as though they’re being shafted or they’re not being given the opportunity to really benefit from this thing that we’re calling hybrid work?

That’s a very good point. We, spoke with, individuals like Lisa Perez in episode number three, Rachel Thomas with Bridgestone Americas. They talk about the exact same thing. Lisa talks about, issues that are being, that are coming to her front door. Now with clients, when it talks about when you do have a hybrid model when you do have a remote, , model and people are at home working, it opens up this entire.

Other, uh, bag of questions, if you will, and liability and responsibility, right. Uh, if I’m at home and if I fall and I’m on your time, what does that look like? Mm-hmm yeah. And it really is traumatizing for a lot of people, especially. Because they worked very hard during the pandemic to make sure that people could get home and work safe.

They worked very hard to make sure that people still felt like they belonged and they had opportunities to and learn sure. And thrive. Despite it felt they were working from home. And we showed the world that, you know, that this working remote. Um, but seeing so difficult before can be done and it can be done effectively to then have leaders who are saying, you know what?

I see my people. I don’t believe that people are actually working every time they say their working. I’m not about giving people the flexibility to, to be their work when they wanna do. And that’s what part of the reason that pushed the great resignation, right? Because people have looked at their. And they recognize that their perspective on lives and work has changed.

That’s right. And they organizations that give them need in for them, their, their lives in way that’s more meaningful. And so as HR professionals, we with retention journey of how do we get our people to stay? How do we give our people what we need while we’re, you know, at the back end? Ling with leaders.

Um, you need to be more reasonable. You need to be more flexible. Why think this can work? How can we make this work? Otherwise we’re gonna lose top. Julie, uh, such a great insight. What do you dare? I asked for like a top three, but what would you say are the top things that are, are, are big pain points that you’re hearing right now when it comes to, you know, HR professional has to balance everything that we’re talking about as the, kind of the conduit between, um, employee, the, the, the teams, if you will, and, and leadership.

Right. Um, and, and being there. You know, all the people in between, what are some of the pain points when it comes to the burnout that you speak of that HR professionals, uh, and a lot of other people are going through, but when it comes to HR and HR professionals, what are some of the top things that you’re hearing from your clients that, that are just overwhelming?

Every conversation after conversation, this, this point is being brought up. This is really a hard one. HR professionals, not only struggle with burnout. We also struggle. Compassion and trauma. So a lot of time and, and it could be any combination or it could be all three of those things at any given point in time.

And when we talk about compassion fatigue, a lot of times we, these things with people who are in caregiver, doctors, nurses, but also also applies to HR because it’s that exhausting of constantly caring to people and listening to people’s problem. Each our professionals are at that stage where they’re just like, it’s not that we, but it’s so it’s overbearing.

It’s so hear it’s. So it’s so experience that they’re exhaust you. Extensive B is a motive of work. Constant back and forth two leaders and people on the ground. It’s just becoming completely overwhelming to the point. A lot of asking themselves where they wanna be. Wow. If they should, considering making a career really are struggling in their rules right now is just becoming.

Too much. And a lot of our, of us are exhausted. We are at our, and just had enough. So those three things compounding together are really causing our people to struggle lot. Julie, would you say that are, are, are you hearing more that. When it comes to hiring specifically. Okay. So I wanna kind of change over to hiring.

Are your clients, uh, hearing more that leadership is still wanting to hire the way that they always have, um, as an issue. And does that equal, uh, or surpass, um, supply are, are there as many good people showing up for those jobs? Are they able to even find those people and have conversations with them? Um, tell us, tell our audience a little bit about, um, those two.

So when it comes to hiring one of the things that I talk about a lot with HR professional talent development, well, um, is the importance of recognizing that you have a larger think. So when we think about that diversity equity and inclusion space, a lot of us mix the people who have neurodiversity. And recognizing that sometimes a lot of people do not interview well.

We realize that we have to change it the way that we interview people, the way that we recruit people, because everyone is not the same one.

And then people look at me and they go, well, what do you mean by that? So for example, You know that people who are on the spectrum for autism are more detail oriented and they’re more creative. Do you know that people with are more creative and they also good with attention to detail, but these people, there are lots of things that you see process that is.

Is it that the person was weird or is it that the person just didn interview? Well, is it that possible that the person had a newer diversity and the questions that you were asking were not leading in such a way that would help the person be able to question adequately? And then now it’s time for us to start looking at organizations who help people.

Neurodiversity to interview well and working with those organizations to create questions, scenario based situations, interview so that we can bring these people into our organization. Lots of companies are doing it LinkedIn to. Lots of companies are doing it just to name a few. Um, Deloitte, lots of them are doing it right.

So how can we go to those companies and how are you getting this done? How are you successfully harnessing this talent? How can we harness this talent? What do organizations organization so that you can. Tap into that specific talent and get what you need. And again, it will cause possibly a hybrid model because people with autism, um, would prefer to work alone.

But if you have the positions that are good for people to thrive in, then create the opportunities. And help them to learn through writing in their organization. So when it comes to hiring, we definitely need to change the way that we ask questions, um, that we recruit people in general. And we also need to be more empathetic and understanding to people situations when we’re going to the process, we can’t go can.

Could possibly up, but we wanna make sure that we’re doing the best that we can on the hiring end to meet the experiences enjoyable as possibly for people. It’s so true. Uh, Julie, um, great feedback. I, I I’ve heard, uh, other conversations around how. Uh, you know, referral bonuses, aren’t being paid out, uh, as quick as they should this thought process that a, a certain department needs to hire by a certain date or hire this position yet.

They’re not able to make a decision on the spot when they have the, the right candidate, the right as they believe the right, uh, candidate in front of them. Um, and so to your point, a lot of. Uh, leadership has to take a different, um, a mindset. Uh, we’re we’re not in the same, uh, world that we were just a couple of years ago.

And people’s needs to your point. Overwhelmingly our research. We did a survey, um, 10 or 11 months ago at this point, uh, we call it the cultural report. We’re actually working on our, our second annual cultural report. Right now we surveyed 2,501 working and looking for work, uh, adults across, uh, north America.

And what we found, uh, was. What you’re saying, people, uh, have, uh, changed their thought process. What used to be yesterday’s all coveted. 401k is today’s, uh, I want to be happy with what I’m doing and, and, and know that I’m a part of something as one aspect. Right? Uh, many other different things. Mm-hmm , but we know that a culture fit as one example.

It’s more important to people, uh, than a 401k. And it’s as important to people as how far they drive, uh, for their actual commute there. That was, uh, one of the bigger pain points that came back, that a lot of people, again, um, um, are having a hard time wrapping their heads around. If you were accustomed to walking outside of your office as a leader and seeing John or Jane sitting in a cubicle.

And that’s how you checked the box and validated, uh, there at work today. Uh, it’s a, it’s a big mind shift and I’ve worked with small businesses for 20 years now, and I believe they’re the engine of all economies. And yes, you talk about, uh, we all talk about very large companies in large scale, and those are always the examples, but middle.

America in this example, but mid-sized companies, uh, have a real hard time individual. When you are a sole proprietor, whether you have an HR, uh, professional, or you you’re hiring that service out, you have a hard time wrapping your mind around if you’re not retail, if you’re maybe in retail, but if you’re not food, if you’re not manufacturing, if you’re not where you actually have to be every single day, this, this trust.

Right is really this question. Mark is opening up. Do we actually even trust each other? Do I trust Julie that because you’re in Barbados, you can work for our company and you can do this thing. Uh, right. That’s a big question going on when, to your point, that talent pool has really opened up wide is, is the decision maker, uh, being progressive enough to follow along.

Yeah, absolutely. Let’s shift real quick. And talk about your book confessions of an HR pro really, uh, really awesome. It was 164 pages. Looks like a very easy read. I skim through it. I, I, uh, I tell, um, our audience and other people that we’ve had on that have written books that, uh, I am a skimmer. Uh, I am more of an audible person, but, um, there were some points in there that I.

That I really liked, but what I wanted to ask you specifically were what are just as an excerpt into the book, you can get it on Amazon. Definitely go check it out again. It’s confessions of an HR pro what are, um, what’s an excerpt of that book? What, what inspired you to write the book? How long did it take?

I’ve always like to, uh, hear that. And, um, what is the feedback you’ve got? And I see the book right there in the background. I’ve read the reviews. Uh, they’re, they’re very, very strong, um, from other HR professionals across the, uh, the world. Uh, tell our audience a little bit about your book experience ions.

So it really the book HR and I wrote this book of experiences that in, during the pandemic, in having conversations with other HR professionals, Um, I had this book in my head, the, the book in head for five years prior to writing it, but the pandemic really me to write this book, just so HR professionals realizing that areas and times I felt alone in my HR career, these people were me and I, and I wasn’t alone.

And. It just encouraged me to, to share these stories and these experiences, because there are so many of us out there who are struggling with our mental health, who are struggling with making the right decisions when it comes to recruiting and getting the right talent, the door advocating for in the organization to get our bonuses, following courses, to get promotions.

Like it really is a struggle. In the space that, and I wanted to share other stories so that people would need it and okay. I’m not alone. Okay. I wasn’t crazy when that actually yes, it, because other, and so that’s why the why behind, um, my writing the book I self-published and created my. Using videos on YouTube.

I love it. Educate me along the loop. I immediately start smiling when you say self-published because, uh, that’s the true hustle of, of, uh, writing a book, right? oh, I I’ve had the opportunity to work with, um, uh, a client that. Uh, wrote their own book and it’s not it’s, it’s not just, Hey, aside from the writing, right.

You’ve gotta actually then tell people about it. tell me how that experience has been using, uh, the platforms to, uh, promote your book. I, on the receiving side of it, um, uh, I think you’re doing a great job. Uh, tell me how that was before the book. Um, did you have the, the energy on all the channels or did the book really kind of, uh, skyrocket you into, uh, the consistency in the, in the.

Um, the distribution that you have today. So that’s a really good question. I started telling my story before, because someone encouraged me. One of my mentors encouraged me to do you really need to tell your story as you do so that people can follow your story, the process of writing their book? Sure.

Whether it’s writing it and then self-publishing it. Um, you need to tell that. And recently I was talking to another one of my friends who said, you really need to tell story as well, like how it’s been repu, but I spent maybe 12 months putting my book together. Oh, wow. Um, yeah, because I decided that I would, um, proud course my book.

So the stories in the book are from other people, as well as. So most of the book is written by me, but there, there are other stories and experiences there that were written by other people. Sure. And I got that idea from someone on LinkedIn, who was like, if you ever wanna write a book and you don’t that’s awesome. I was kinda. That pushed me over the edge to write my book. Sure. Because I was struggling to write it on my own, but then crowdsourcing my book and asking other people, if they would be interested in sharing their story. And then all of a sudden people were like, yes, And so that made it a whole lot easier for me to put, a lot of people ask me questions about how I did it, but I little blog about it. I also. From time to time. So I wrote a blog about it so that people could see that it was something that’s not far right. You can that’s right. Write your own. Yeah. How many professionals are out there just like you that have had experiences, uh, writing or not.

Right. I, I think there used to be this thought process that if you weren’t really a writer, you couldn’t write today. There’s so many tools out there that really can help you along the way. Uh, but um, that being said, you said it took about a year, uh, and now we’re about a year into it. Right. So did you published, you actually had it, uh, in your hands in June of last year, correct?

Yes. Yes. And then when did, what year was Ted. Was this year, was it? So did the book, did the book parlay you write directly into TEDx? So funny enough, what happened again? One of my connections on LinkedIn love LinkedIn, um, I absolutely love LinkedIn. I was having a conversation with her one day and I was, we were talking about what we wanted to accomplish and she was actually on her to doing her first talk.

And I said to her, you know, that’s on bucket list of things that I wanna do one of these days. So this conversation was happening of last year and she was why don’t do it now. And I was like, huh, I’m in the middle of writing my book. I’m not ready to do a Ted talk. He was like, you can do it. Trust me, you, the story is there.

You have a great story. It needs to be told now. And she said, I’m, you need to meet her. And she introduced was helping.

We had a session. We started working together, um, before I knew it landed my talk in December last year. So, um, by the end of the year, I, I knew that I was gonna this talk and of the year sharing with my, my community, that this talk and it was supposed to be in March, but cause of COVID restrictions and stuff, it got pushed back to April.

So I ended up gonna Austria to on April. So was it everything you thought it was gonna be?

And then some, I saw the pictures that, that you share and it, uh, I, I think it was like the studio or the auditorium before, you know, the people got there and it’s, it’s pretty daunting. It is very daunting. And then there’s a whole bunch of cameras right in front of you and they’re taking shots of you every direction.

And then there’s still a cameraman on the ground walking through and taking shots as well. And then you have this of people just sitting there in front of you taking in your story and you’re a timer, right. It’s going against of time. Right? Well, this is, yeah. And the funny thing. My talk was supposed to be between 12 to 18 minutes.

I think my pet talk is 20 minutes and they still published it. There you go. That’s always good. Yeah. Uh, well, uh, I have had so much fun having a conversation with you, uh, this morning, Julie. Um, again, Julie attorney, founder of HR at heart consulting St. Thomas Barbados is where she is comfortably located.

Uh, although it’s a little overcast today, uh, if you want to connect with Julie, all of her links are in our show notes below again, go over to Amazon and grab confessions of an HR pro Julie, thank you so much for being on with us. I do have one more question for you. I want you to, uh, Our audience on how Julie Turner defines workplace culture.

How would I depend what this culture? It everybody’s business. It’s not an HR thing. It’s not a leadership thing. Everybody plays part when it comes to workplace culture. It’s not something that we sit down in our office as HR and, and create, and then we push it out to people and go, we have a culture.

Everybody is involved in that process. It’s a feeling of belonging and sharing. It’s how you create a community. That’s, that’s what culture is a community of people who, whether we agree or. We still respect each other. We live by a certain set of values, but it’s something we create together. It’s not something that’s created in the final.

That’s the best way I could describe it. I think that is the best way to describe it. Julie attorney, thank you so much. If you have not, please click over, uh, to the subscribe button and if you’d like this conversation amongst others, please do take, we think it’s 45 seconds. I, I think I’ve actually timed it.

Go on and leave us a. Clicking subscribe and writing. A couple of words helps this podcast reach so many other people. So Julie Turner, thank you so much for your time. Thank.